Replacing a Stem Cartridge Spindle For Symmons Temptrol Shower Valve

JGaulard

JGaulard

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Aug 1, 2020
Messages
327
Reaction score
18
Points
23
  • #1
Wouldn’t you just know it. As I was writing yesterday’s post about fixing a leaky Symmons shower valve, the only part I still needed was sitting in our mailbox. I could have replaced everything at the same time. Oh well. I guess I have to stick to my plan for replacing some parts and then replacing the final one this morning. That’s what I just did, so the project is now finished. What we presently have is a smooth new valve that turns off the way it’s supposed to. It’s strange – it actually feels “cushiony” now. No more abrupt stop when I turn off the water. It’s truly magnificent that I don’t see that drip, drip, drip anymore as well. Truly magnificent.

------

This post is part of my "Symmons" shower valve series. Over the years, I've learned quite about this brand of shower valves; I've installed them from scratch and I've repaired them as well. Click through the links below to learn how to do these things yourself. And be sure to ask questions if you have them.

How to Fix a Symmons Shower Valve That Leaks
Replacing a Stem Cartridge Spindle For Symmons Temptrol Shower Valve
Installing a Symmons One Handle Shower Faucet

------

The part I was waiting for is called a Stem Cartridge Spindle For Symmons TA-10 Temptrol and it looks like this:

symmons-temptrol-spindle.jpg

To be honest with you, I think I could have gotten away with replacing just this one part to stop the leak. Since I wasn’t sure about that, I went ahead with everything. If I had done just this, I could have avoided the expense of purchasing the special tool I introduced in my previous post, along with all those other parts. This temptrol spindle comes with all the necessary washers installed on the spindle already, as well as one larger one that slides right into place. They’re all very obviously seated.

If you’re wondering what this spindle does, let me tell you. The two rubber washers that are mounted on this thing stop any leaks that might exist if they weren’t there. Also, it controls the balance between hot and cold water. Finally, if your shower valve feel very tight when you try to turn it, this is probably the culprit. Replace this one part with only a screwdriver and a pair of channellocks and you’re all set. The total price will be just a hair over $23.

Since I loaded my previous post up with 26 pictures, I won’t bore you with them again. What I will do is show you what the old temptrol spindle looked like after I pulled it out of the housing.

old-temptrol-spindle.jpg

Since the kit came with a replacement washer for whatever it is this piece is called, I went ahead and removed the old one and popped on the new one.

replacing-large-washer.jpg

After that, I applied some grease to the threads of the new spindle. It ends up that I put on way too much grease. I had to remove some because I made a mess.

greasing-new-spindle.jpg

And then, I screwed the new spindle into place.

replacement-symmons-temptrol-spindle.jpg

I lightly greased the part of the new spindle that has all those holes in it so it slides through the large valve seat easier. Then, I added some more grease to the fine threads on the old part and I pushed the entire combination back into the valve housing. But not before taking a sweet photo of both the old and new spindles. If you take a look at the new one, you’ll see the chrome looking ring I referred to in yesterday’s post. This is what holds one of the rubber washers into place and this is what’s nearly impossible to remove without damaging the entire spindle. For $23, you can avoid that whole mess and simply replace the entire thing.

comparing-old-new-spindles.jpg

Finally, I screwed it back into place and put the cover and handle back into position.

reattaching-spindle-assembly.jpg

Job well done, I’d say. I can’t wait to share my next project here. I love working on this type of stuff. So far, I’ve got plans to clean our pellet stove fan and replace the check valve on our well pump. Thanks for reading!

PS – If you’re water is coming out only lukewarm when you turn it to hot, there is either one of two things going on. First, you may have a faulty spindle. Even if you hear the “clicking” when you shake it back and forth, there may be something wrong that’s not letting the water get hot enough.

If it’s not that and you’re sure the spindle is working properly, you may have to adjust the temperature by turning what’s called the Temptrol Limit Stop Screw. This set screw controls how hot the water gets. Here’s a photo of it.

symmons-temptrol-adjusting-temperature.jpg

If you turn the water valve to the off position and then turn the set screw in (clockwise) a few turns, you’ll make the hottest water temperature cooler. If you loosen the screw somewhat (counter-clockwise), you’ll make the water hotter. Again though, if you loosen the screw as much as it will go, without falling out or leaking, and the water still isn’t hot, you likely need to replace the spindle, even if it’s brand new. Beware of knockoff plumbing brands. You need the real “Symmons” stuff when it comes to this. The word Symmons will be stamped right into the metal.
 
WendyMay

WendyMay

Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2020
Messages
88
Reaction score
0
Points
11
  • #2
I realize question is so simple. When replacing this part do I need to turn my water off? I live in a condo ( one shut off for all 15 units!) and I’m trying to avoid having a plumber come out to take care of this when I know I can do it myself. My condo insist that if the water is being turned off to the units you need to have a license worker. I’ve not been able to find a shut off for my shower or a whole house shut off in my unit. Thank you!
 
JGaulard

JGaulard

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Aug 1, 2020
Messages
327
Reaction score
18
Points
23
  • #3
WendyMay said:
I realize question is so simple. When replacing this part do I need to turn my water off? I live in a condo ( one shut off for all 15 units!) and I’m trying to avoid having a plumber come out to take care of this when I know I can do it myself. My condo insist that if the water is being turned off to the units you need to have a license worker. I’ve not been able to find a shut off for my shower or a whole house shut off in my unit. Thank you!
Hi Wendy,

Unfortunately, yes, your water definitely needs to be shut off.

Jay
 
15Katey

15Katey

Member
Joined
Aug 8, 2020
Messages
85
Reaction score
3
Points
13
  • #4
I replaced the spindle and hot and cold seats. I now have to crank the faucet shut very hard so that it doesn’t drip cold water after the repair. Did I not tighten the cold seat or something else enough?
 
JGaulard

JGaulard

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Aug 1, 2020
Messages
327
Reaction score
18
Points
23
  • #5
15Katey said:
I replaced the spindle and hot and cold seats. I now have to crank the faucet shut very hard so that it doesn’t drip cold water after the repair. Did I not tighten the cold seat or something else enough?
Hi Katey,

Mine does the same thing. It gets better over time though, so don’t worry about it.

Jay
 
EmeraldHike

EmeraldHike

Member
Joined
Aug 8, 2020
Messages
85
Reaction score
0
Points
11
  • #6
How do I remove the knob? I have a two home harden brass knob I can’t remove. I actually broke it off the valve.
 
JodyBuchanan

JodyBuchanan

Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2020
Messages
84
Reaction score
0
Points
11
  • #7
When installing the symmons valve stem, should it be open?

Also, you need to open the valve to remove the cap and stem and sometimes you have to play with it a bit.. Important info to know.
 
KristinaW

KristinaW

Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2020
Messages
86
Reaction score
2
Points
13
  • #8
A very helpful article. Thank you.

What is the part number for the exact part shown in the same picture as the Temptrol Limit Stop Screw?
 
Newman

Newman

Member
Joined
Aug 5, 2020
Messages
100
Reaction score
0
Points
21
  • #9
Jay, these articles were great, encouraged me to attempt to fix my leak of this mysterious valve. I hit some problems and would love your response. First, getting the valve seats out proved…. impossible. My existing valve had a lot of corrosion. When I had the big square end of the R1241 tool well seated in the bigger, outer valve seat, my gentle counter-clock-wise pressure simply stripped out the little notches. At that point, removing them was hopeless. Thankfully, the existing seats appear to be healthy. The hot water seat appears flat. So I proceeded *without* replacing the valve seats.

My second problem is the hot/cold temperature behaves oddly and is never hot enough, After assembly, without touching the valve, the temperature occasionally varies, From cold to colder and back to cold. The hot water adjustment screw is backed out just enough that it doesn’t limit hot water. I have dissembled and reassembled it several times. The new valve assembly rattles and has Symmons name stamped on it. I can’t believe the one new part I am actually need to use is faulty. I’m hoping there is something I did wrong. NOTE: The old valve assembly doesn’t rattle, It may have corroded in the ‘hot’ mode.
 
JGaulard

JGaulard

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Aug 1, 2020
Messages
327
Reaction score
18
Points
23
  • #10
Newman said:
Jay, these articles were great, encouraged me to attempt to fix my leak of this mysterious valve. I hit some problems and would love your response. First, getting the valve seats out proved…. impossible. My existing valve had a lot of corrosion. When I had the big square end of the R1241 tool well seated in the bigger, outer valve seat, my gentle counter-clock-wise pressure simply stripped out the little notches. At that point, removing them was hopeless. Thankfully, the existing seats appear to be healthy. The hot water seat appears flat. So I proceeded *without* replacing the valve seats.

My second problem is the hot/cold temperature behaves oddly and is never hot enough, After assembly, without touching the valve, the temperature occasionally varies, From cold to colder and back to cold. The hot water adjustment screw is backed out just enough that it doesn’t limit hot water. I have dissembled and reassembled it several times. The new valve assembly rattles and has Symmons name stamped on it. I can’t believe the one new part I am actually need to use is faulty. I’m hoping there is something I did wrong. NOTE: The old valve assembly doesn’t rattle, It may have corroded in the ‘hot’ mode.
Hi Newman,

Great comment and questions. I appreciate you writing in. I was lucky to have everything go relatively smoothly during my repair, but I feel for you with yours. Repairing valves like this is frustrating enough, but to have parts that won’t come loose and other issues can be stressful. I don’t know much about why your assembly might be rattling, but I will tell you that my water only gets lukewarm in the winter ever since I replaced the valve (or parts). Maybe a bit hotter than that, but nowhere near how hot it used to get. I first bought a knockoff stem cartridge and that gave me only lukewarm water. I returned that one and bought a Symmons cartridge, thinking there was something wrong with the first one. Apparently there wasn’t. Both of them perform the same. In the summer, the water gets much hotter, but that’s just because my cold water feed isn’t as cold as it is in the winter. I’m thinking the cold/hot ratio is different in these newer stem cartridges than they were in the old ones.

I installed an entirely new Symmons shower valve in a different bathroom and I can report that it is incredible. It’s a bit larger than the one I repaired (mentioned in this post) and the water gets very hot and the pressure is great. The repaired valve is upstairs and the replaced one is downstairs. I’m not sure if that makes a difference.

Let me know what you find out and what happens. I’m sorry I can’t be of more help. Good luck!

Jay
 
B

bogensjr

New Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2021
Messages
3
Reaction score
1
Points
3
  • #11
Great info! I’ve pulled everything out, put in the new cartridge however it doesn’t go in as far as your picture. In fact when I go to screw the assembly into the unit it tightens so much that I can’t turn the knob…what am I doing wrong? Suggestions/fixes welcome. Thanks in advance!!
 
JGaulard

JGaulard

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Aug 1, 2020
Messages
327
Reaction score
18
Points
23
  • #12
bogensjr said:
Great info! I’ve pulled everything out, put in the new cartridge however it doesn’t go in as far as your picture. In fact when I go to screw the assembly into the unit it tightens so much that I can’t turn the knob…what am I doing wrong? Suggestions/fixes welcome. Thanks in advance!!
Hi there - Is there a way you can take some photos and post them here? I wonder if the replacement part is the exact same as the part you're replacing. I'd love to be able to see them side by side.
 
B

bogensjr

New Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2021
Messages
3
Reaction score
1
Points
3
  • #13
JGaulard said:
Hi there - Is there a way you can take some photos and post them here? I wonder if the replacement part is the exact same as the part you're replacing. I'd love to be able to see them side by side.
image.jpg

This is the new one. I was thinking the same thing, however when I put the old one back in I get the same result with the space. I purchased the TA-10 replacement from Symmons.
Thank you!!
 
JGaulard

JGaulard

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Aug 1, 2020
Messages
327
Reaction score
18
Points
23
  • #14
bogensjr said:
View attachment 2352

This is the new one. I was thinking the same thing, however when I put the old one back in I get the same result with the space. I purchased the TA-10 replacement from Symmons.
Thank you!!
Thanks for the photo. This is very weird. So not only is the new spindle not screwing all the way into the housing, but the old one isn't either. So we know it's not the new part. It's got to be something with the threads inside the housing or the sleeve the spindle slides through. Did you grease the new part before pushing it through? When you try to screw it in, is it a hard stop or do things progressively get tighter? One last thing - that warm water set screw isn't in the way, right? I don't have mine apart anymore, but I seem to remember a hot water adjustment screw. I don't think that goes near the threads though...
 
B

bogensjr

New Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2021
Messages
3
Reaction score
1
Points
3
  • #15
JGaulard said:
Thanks for the photo. This is very weird. So not only is the new spindle not screwing all the way into the housing, but the old one isn't either. So we know it's not the new part. It's got to be something with the threads inside the housing or the sleeve the spindle slides through. Did you grease the new part before pushing it through? When you try to screw it in, is it a hard stop or do things progressively get tighter? One last thing - that warm water set screw isn't in the way, right? I don't have mine apart anymore, but I seem to remember a hot water adjustment screw. I don't think that goes near the threads though...
Indeed very strange!! You are correct, hot water screw isn’t affecting anything (tried it 3ways just to be sure). All pieces look and feel free of obstacles for the threads. It feels like a hard stop, everything greased up, every time (new and old), not even sure the strongest could twist it into place let alone very getting it back out. I did sort of try, but needed a vice to get the 2 apart. Tomorrow I’ll be doing a full replacement, very much appreciate you time and responses!! Cheers to soldering!
 
  • Like
Reactions: JGaulard
JGaulard

JGaulard

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Aug 1, 2020
Messages
327
Reaction score
18
Points
23
  • #16
bogensjr said:
Indeed very strange!! You are correct, hot water screw isn’t affecting anything (tried it 3ways just to be sure). All pieces look and feel free of obstacles for the threads. It feels like a hard stop, everything greased up, every time (new and old), not even sure the strongest could twist it into place let alone very getting it back out. I did sort of try, but needed a vice to get the 2 apart. Tomorrow I’ll be doing a full replacement, very much appreciate you time and responses!! Cheers to soldering!
Thanks for the update. I guess it'll remain a mystery. If you replace with a Symmons and feel that you did a nice job that you'd like to show off, please feel free to post some photos here. People love that sort of thing. Thanks and good luck with the project!
 
Replacing a Stem Cartridge Spindle For Symmons Temptrol Shower Valve was posted on 08-23-2021 by JGaulard in the Home Forum forum.

Forum statistics

Threads
523
Messages
1,665
Members
39
Latest member
TaylorHaskings
Site by Gaulard.com.
Top